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Author Topic: Dark Eldar rules changes?  (Read 17250 times)

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Offline horizon

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #45 on: November 09, 2010, 06:50:35 PM »
Hmm, mmehh. Whoa, I am worse!

I rather like a general holofield system for Dark Eldar, Corsair Eldar and Craftworld Eldar.*

Dark Eldar gain bonus from Mimic Engine as a DE specific "toy".



* Keep in mind I ditch the msm system for CE & CWE.


Offline flybywire-E2C

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #46 on: November 09, 2010, 08:27:20 PM »
Hmm, mmehh. Whoa, I am worse!

I rather like a general holofield system for Dark Eldar, Corsair Eldar and Craftworld Eldar.*

Dark Eldar gain bonus from Mimic Engine as a DE specific "toy".



* Keep in mind I ditch the msm system for CE & CWE.



Agreed, but here's the problem. Yes, I know the biggest problem for a lot of people is MSM, but we are NOT adressing core rules right now. Basically the new DE Codex incorporates a mechanic to make them harder to hit that seems to work perfectly for the DE in BFG, since they DON'T benefit from MSM and they have to end movement prow-on in order to fire optimally. This seems to be a quick-and-dirty fix using a mechanic already in place until we address this more thoroughly in the future.

- Nate
Check out the BFG repository page for all the documents we have in work:
http://tinyurl.com/23nul8q
:) Smile, game on and enjoy!           - Nate

Offline Plaxor

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #47 on: November 10, 2010, 04:15:30 PM »
Dark Eldar gain bonus from Mimic Engine as a DE specific "toy".

I agree, I think DE are a quite underpowered, and mimic engines are just too expensive to buy for a little benefit. I think a good balancing technique would be to give them the upgrade for free.

Offline fracas

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #48 on: November 10, 2010, 04:42:13 PM »
Dark Eldar gain bonus from Mimic Engine as a DE specific "toy".

I agree, I think DE are a quite underpowered, and mimic engines are just too expensive to buy for a little benefit. I think a good balancing technique would be to give them the upgrade for free.

Yes mimic engines should be standard for DE and leave the shdowfield as is

Offline Zhukov

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #49 on: November 10, 2010, 05:44:39 PM »
If anything, a Dread Archon's personal flagship would probaly have one or two refits as opposed to being something significantly larger or more powerful. The Dread Archon refits idea is something that can be added to the Eldar Domain rules if there is enough support, but we are not looking at creating a larger ship class, especially something that can't be easily modeled (meaning available as a single kit).

An easy solution at creating a "bigger class of vessel in one kit" is to have the player just add fins and such that are supplied when buying a booster pack to the cruiser. Case in point, the Dark Eldar cruiser in Gothicomp this year. That was incredibly easy to build and looks MUCH bigger than the other cruisers when side by side against them. (Most players call it a Battleship even though it's only a cruiser!)

Shadowfield. The Dark Eldar utilize Shadowfields on all their starships, a more powerful and extremely stealthy version of the Night Shields utilized by their surface units. They work in the same manner as Holofields but impart an additional right-column shift (after all other modifiers are applied) to that provided by normal Holofields.

I personally don't like this rule. The Eldar use the theory "speed=armor" and the Dark Eldar are "armor=armor" since they get 5+ armor on the cruisers. If you want to make a stronger Dark Eldar fleet, give the escorts 5+ armor too. Otherwise, don't change the rules for this fleet solely becasue they got an update in 40k.


Can we please give the Dark Eldar cruiser 2 Impalers in stead of 1??? There is ZERO incentive to arm a cruiser with the same armament as an escort!!!!

-Zhukov
I am Zukov's Klaw.

"Oh mah gawd its like a giant veil was just lifted off my face and the beautiful maiden before my eyes just turned into a hideous Ork with a giant, bloody choppa."

Offline Plaxor

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #50 on: November 10, 2010, 07:33:12 PM »
Zhukov, yes the impaler needs to be doubled to have any worth on a torture. As well I could see the escorts being raised to 5 and instead having the mimic engines dropped to half cost.

Offline lastspartacus

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #51 on: November 10, 2010, 11:06:45 PM »
I was thinking the same thing recently.  Give it kind of a tusked look.

Offline flybywire-E2C

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #52 on: November 12, 2010, 04:39:40 PM »
This is pasted in from the Eldar Domains thread:

Zhukov,

Man oh man you could not be more right! Too many things on my brain like wanting DE to be more normal than Eldar!  ;D

Cheers,

RayB HA

Zhukov,

Ray, Bob and I see eye to eye on the DE in a lot of ways, and this fleet can be made really right with just a few tweaks. In the meantime, we may pull the Eldar Domains project back into hock and graft in any changes we make to the Dark Eldar concerning the Impaler, Mimic Engine, etc.

Concerning the Mimic engine itself, my son and I both like playing DE and agree this is a bit expensive for what it does (my son won't use it solely because of the price), but it should not necessarily be free.

- Nate

Check out the BFG repository page for all the documents we have in work:
http://tinyurl.com/23nul8q
:) Smile, game on and enjoy!           - Nate

Offline Sigoroth

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #53 on: November 13, 2010, 02:40:51 AM »
While you're at it, you can ditch a tonne of those Eldar refits too. Crap.

Offline Oqlanth

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #54 on: November 19, 2010, 01:04:00 AM »
Hailings from Turkey! :D
This is my first post so first of all I wish to greet you. As moderator of the only BFG community of Turkey I have to apology from you to learn this site very late.

As topic is Dark Eldar rules changes i think it is ok for me to talk about some rule change suggestion and some rule questions for dark eldar :D May be I can make enough lobby to change things in next offical changes :)

Rule Change Suggestion:

1- Impaler Assault Modules of Tortune Class Cruisers
As mentioned above 'single' assault module is expensive and less effective than any other options. I think for Tortune Class ships Impaler Assault Modules' strength 2.

2- Mimic Engines
Minic Engines are one of the trade mark features of Dark Eldar fleet but unfortunately overcosty when compared to it's effectiveness. And also makes fleet building very difficult.

Dark Eldar escorts becomes 70 points and cruisers become 250+ points (270-290) and unless you made regular combinations like 3 mimic escorts + 1 mimic cruiser with bays (this combination is 500 pts).

Also mimic engines have no use against necron or tyranids and have little use against most senarios (raids, etc)

And 70 points for Armour 4+ escort is very expensive!!!

So I suggest mimic engines will be default 'free' feature for Dark Eldar ships.

3- Large Dark Eldar Ship
I am at the side with 'no battleship for Dark Eldars'. It is unfluffy but a flagship like cruiser, similar to CWE's Flame of Asuryman will be great.

This ship can be based on default Tortune Class cruiser. And may like this one:


Fleet may include up to one flagship. Flagship only avalaible for 1000 points or higher fleets. If there is a flagship in your fleet your Dread Archon must be assigned to her.

0-1
300 points - Cruiser/8 - Speed:35cm - Turns 90 - Shield:Shadowfield - Armour: 5+ - Turrets:0

Prow Batteries Strength:12, 30cm, Front - Launch Bays, 4, Fighters 30cm,Bombers 20cm,Boats 30cm -
And pick one from Below:
Prow Phantom Lance, Strength 2 30cm, Front
Prow Torpedo Tubes, Strength 4 30cm, Front
2xImpaler Assault Module, Special, Attack Craft, 30cm, Front


4-Victory Points for Slaveraids
I suggest after succesfull hit and run attack with Impaler Assault Module attacker may choose to take 30 Victory Points instead of rolling 2d6 for critical hit.

Questions about Dark Eldar Rules:
Well I got some confusions for Dark Eldar rules. Here they are:

1-Attack Crafts
In 2007FAQ it says: Dark Eldar attack craft re-roll misses and enjoy any other benefits of equivalent Eldar attack craft.
So;
Raptor Fighter may re-roll 4+ save to remain in play.
Razorwing Bombers may re-roll how many attacks it makes (like other Eldar Bombers) AND re-roll misses in it's attacks.
Slavebringers may re-roll misses (1s) when enemy also has hit&run modifier (i.e. Space Marines).
Impaler Assault Modules may re-roll their missed 4+ saves against enemy Fighters AND may re-roll missed (1s) hit&run dices on first d6.

And all Assault Craft (and all other Dark Eldar ordrance) can only hit by turrets with 6s.

Am I correct?

2-Ordrance and Mimic Engines
If I release ordrance (assault craft) when under cover with Mimic Engines and can not be targetted by enemy, do I lose my coverage?

That's all from me for now. I want to apology again for my terrible English (it becomes worse after sleepless nights like this one! :S ).
Thanks
« Last Edit: November 19, 2010, 01:25:03 AM by Oqlanth »

Offline flybywire-E2C

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #55 on: November 26, 2010, 02:28:31 AM »
Zhukov, yes the impaler needs to be doubled to have any worth on a torture. As well I could see the escorts being raised to 5 and instead having the mimic engines dropped to half cost.

Allowing a DE cruiser to have two Impalers has passed muster with the HA's and will be in the FAQ. We are still discussing Mimic engines.

- Nate

Check out the BFG repository page for all the documents we have in work:
http://tinyurl.com/23nul8q
:) Smile, game on and enjoy!           - Nate

Offline Plaxor

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #56 on: November 26, 2010, 05:29:17 AM »
Thnx Nate. *win dance*

Offline Zhukov

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #57 on: November 28, 2010, 05:29:12 AM »

YES on the Impalers :)

I do agree the Mimic engine should not be free. How about just dropping it to +10 points for escorts or cruisers to take it and leave all other points costs the same? Played a few games that way and didn't have any issues with playability.

-Zhukov
I am Zukov's Klaw.

"Oh mah gawd its like a giant veil was just lifted off my face and the beautiful maiden before my eyes just turned into a hideous Ork with a giant, bloody choppa."

Offline lastspartacus

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #58 on: November 28, 2010, 05:37:20 AM »
Thatl look really cool to model.  I believe mimic engines should be a standard fleet ability of the DE.

Free option for a single?
« Last Edit: November 28, 2010, 05:38:59 AM by lastspartacus »

Offline Oqlanth

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Re: Dark Eldar rules changes?
« Reply #59 on: November 28, 2010, 12:17:13 PM »
if launching ordrance removes mimic engines stealth ability then they have to be free.