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Author Topic: Nova Cannon -House Rules-  (Read 29066 times)

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Offline Valhallan

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #105 on: August 02, 2010, 06:45:34 PM »
thanks for finishing that math for me!

i had brought up that it didn't account for scatter a few pages back when i first thought up the idea. my nc does 4 max damage, not 3 (d3 for the hole, +1 for the temp), the fact that it can re-roll scatter means its more useful for the true purpose of an NC - to keep the enemy from bunching up.

i do agree, if i want consistent damage, i run a torp fleet as well.

Offline Eldanesh

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #106 on: August 03, 2010, 12:30:31 AM »
I don't see the use of lock on as an advantage, especially not for the Mars class.

1. An additional moral check is never an advantage. In general one of the main concepts (especially in larger battles) is to keep the number of necessary command checks as low as possible (this is the reason why you consider Squadrons of cruisers: fewer checks on the better value). If I need lock on just to "hold" the NC on a similiar level (or a modest increase at longer ranges), this is a real bad trade for any IN Admiral.

2. If a ship is on lock on, you can't give any other special rules. Sure, this is no Problem for Apocalypse, Dominator or any Lunar with Nc upgrade, but it hurts a Mars, which can't reload it's launch bays while firing the NC.

3. Back to the table: I simply LOVE the psychological effekt of that weapon: to be honest no rational player sets his absolutly untouched carrier to BFI just because there is a 5-9%(depending on Range) Chance for 6 hits.
And thats the point where pure sadism walks in  ;D
Me: "oh, hit"
Opponent: "please, anything but no 6"
me: trows dice....evil grin.... "6" :D
And, hey, this is really a perfect expression of the the way of the Imperium: come over Chaos scum, I'll show you who has the biggest dick..erm...guns ^^


Offline Valhallan

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #107 on: August 04, 2010, 01:55:15 AM »
yes you speak some truth about the fear factor - however an argument to keep the NC the same on a House Rules thread is kinda useless. i like the fact that if i can hit i can drop a cruisers shields at minimum, but sacrifice the higher damage.


good point on the mars though... good thing i stopped fielding them, probably why my system works well.

cheers!

Offline RayB HA

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #108 on: August 04, 2010, 07:34:00 PM »
Sorry to sound like a broken record but I'll never be comfortable with multiple D6 scatter (in any game actually). There's too much wrong with it probability-wise and in BFG the scale is tested also!

If for some reason you wanted to scatter more than 6cm I would say get a bigger dice! But this is BFG anymore than 6cm is one hell of a miss!

Cheers,

RayB   
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When I joined the Corp we didn't have any fancy smancy tanks! We had sticks! Two sticks and a rock for an entire platoon, and we had to share the rock!

Offline Eldanesh

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #109 on: August 06, 2010, 03:41:10 AM »
Well, if multiple scatter dice are the problem, why don't keep the rules simple:

-D6 damage if "hole" touched, 1 damage if touched by template
-range: 30-150cm, scatters 1D6, regardless of range, a "hit" still scatters, but distance is halved, rounded up (1-2=1cm, 2-4=2cm, 5-6=3cm)
- to use a nova cannon a succesful "reload ordnance"- roll is needed
- Battleship mounted NC's throw 2D6 for scatter distance and take the lowest AND throw 2D6 for damage and take the highest

Average damage is 1,78 for small Bases and 2,44 for large Bases.

This is a simple rule, without "harming" the NC: you get a drawback at small Bases at short distance, but a reasonable increase over long/medium distances. This amount of damage seems fair to me, as a NC usually costs ~20p more than torpedos and therefore  should deliver more damage than a torpedo tube. the "reload ordnance" is a little "price to pay" for Dominators or upgraded Lunars without harming the (IMO already overpriced) Mars. the last paragraph is in to help the underperforming Apocalypse. It doesn't solve the problem of "Nova spamming", but this is something the players must solve by reason and good manners: at all it isn't worse than Devastor-Spam, Explorer-Spam or Eldar just using destroyers....

Offline DarknessEternal

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #110 on: August 06, 2010, 04:39:53 AM »
Sorry to sound like a broken record but I'll never be comfortable with multiple D6 scatter (in any game actually). There's too much wrong with it probability-wise and in BFG the scale is tested also!

If for some reason you wanted to scatter more than 6cm I would say get a bigger dice! But this is BFG anymore than 6cm is one hell of a miss!

Cheers,

RayB   

Are you really championing a weapon doing 6 damage and having a max scatter of 6cm?  That's ridiculous.

Offline Eldanesh

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #111 on: August 06, 2010, 10:50:12 PM »
It's doing a D6 Damage, not 6 damage - a small but elemental difference. ;)

Offline Don Gusto

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #112 on: August 12, 2010, 01:55:25 PM »
Sorry to sound like a broken record but I'll never be comfortable with multiple D6 scatter (in any game actually). There's too much wrong with it probability-wise and in BFG the scale is tested also!

If for some reason you wanted to scatter more than 6cm I would say get a bigger dice! But this is BFG anymore than 6cm is one hell of a miss!
If the probability is a problem you could always replace extra dice with a multiplier.
e.g.
1d6 = d6
2d6 = (d6)x2
3d6 = (d6)x3 ...

I find the argument of realistic scale in BFG a bit odd though. From its approach BFG (and 40k in general) is not really science fiction.
i.e. scale serves fluff (and gameplay for that matter).

Offline DarknessEternal

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #113 on: August 13, 2010, 12:26:17 AM »

If for some reason you wanted to scatter more than 6cm I would say get a bigger dice! But this is BFG anymore than 6cm is one hell of a miss!

I've been thinking about this and it's sort of faulty.  6cm is only 4% of a nova cannon's range.  That's not that exceptional of a miss.

That's within reasonable proximity if we go by the intrawar-period military standards 40k is based on.  Heck, it's super accurate.

Offline lastspartacus

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #114 on: September 22, 2010, 04:48:12 AM »
So I figured with 8 pages of debate, there must be something interesting here.  Any summary without me having to read through it all?

Offline RayB HA

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Re: Nova Cannon -House Rules-
« Reply #115 on: November 09, 2010, 12:51:47 AM »
Where I stand with the rules:

30cm-150cm range.
Scatter dice with D6cm scatter. Where a hit is 0cm scatter if the firing ship didn't turn.

You have to target a ship/defence or ordy marker/wave. Target priority is identical to other weapons, so you must pass a leadership test not to shoot the closest target.

D6 damage with the hole over the stem,
D3 with the hole over the base,
1 damage with the outer template over the base.   

You may not have more capital ships with NC's as without.

And that's it....


Halving D6 damage is a D3, why not just say D3?

Multipliers of D6 have the problem of missing values. There is no 5cm scatter from D6x3cm.

In terms of accuracy I'm comparing it to All other weapons in BFG.

Cheers,

RayB HA
+++++++++++

When I joined the Corp we didn't have any fancy smancy tanks! We had sticks! Two sticks and a rock for an entire platoon, and we had to share the rock!